Team Hoian/hayhay/sidtip vs Team Kittenz/Bote (TomMAffolter)

[hoian]

Thanks lausung. At least u came forward to validate that what I said is the truth. No worries about the hotel... I dun own it... and my experiences there has been pleasant so far. In fact, one of the receptionists working there is rather cute but she has resigned already.

Tom-wadever is a sly fox and will use all kinds of tactics (including clones) to dig dirt on ppl... unfortunately for him, I have no dirt on me.

About your gal, I was only kidding about asking for her colleagues contact. I did in fact ask u to remove her photo for her sake because she is not WL and this forum is full of opportunists like Tom-wadever. You already mentioned to me where she worked but I was not bothered to remember or take it down. If u are still in touch with her, you can verify this fact. I have my own gfs in VN and has no use for more.

PS: I kinda figured it would be you. Tom-wadever made it sound like I go around begging ppl for contacts when in fact I have never PMed anybody. Most of the time ppl PM me... and I can tell u the only ppl I have bothered to click "reply" was H88, yourself and Wendella (if my memory serves me right).

Originally Posted by lausung

I not sure if He is refering to me. But i only tell 1 person in this forum that u ask for contact from me. I dun noe if that person spread around. To clear all these doubts, below is a print screen for your pm to me.

[lausung]

No problem, that time i also puzzled why u ask me for contact since u speak vietnamese well and girls i meet are english speaking girl. Now i know is a joke.

Originally Posted by hoian

Thanks lausung. At least u came forward to validate that what I said is the truth. No worries about the hotel... I dun own it... and my experiences there has been pleasant so far. In fact, one of the receptionists working there is rather cute but she has resigned already.

Tom-wadever is a sly fox and will use all kinds of tactics (including clones) to dig dirt on ppl... unfortunately for him, I have no dirt on me.

About your gal, I was only kidding about asking for her colleagues contact. I did in fact ask u to remove her photo for her sake because she is not WL and this forum is full of opportunists like Tom-wadever. You already mentioned to me where she worked but I was not bothered to remember or take it down. If u are still in touch with her, you can verify this fact. I have my own gfs in VN and has no use for more.

PS: I kinda figured it would be you. Tom-wadever made it sound like I go around begging ppl for contacts when in fact I have never PMed anybody. Most of the time ppl PM me... and I can tell u the only ppl I have bothered to click "reply" was H88, yourself and Wendella (if my memory serves me right).

[Wendella]

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

yes i have DONE THIS, i dont get any stories of guys going bareback etc etc, what i do get is stories fo guys who fuck but then refuse to pay, and odly enough she has told be foreigners do that also, tho she didnt say what nationality of foreigners...but you also know that these lower rungs girls ALL have pimps, who are very close by so if there are guys who are thinking of being nasty or sadistic then they know that there is going to be trouble...liek wise i have had plenty of online girls ask if i had a drink, and when i asked further they said they refuse customers who are drunk

Online girls can refuse you if you are drunk. Obviously there's a reason for that, or they would't do it. Can motorbike girls do that?

I can't find your post that mentioned white guys in AC groping girls. I think there was one about me myself groping a girl in a cafe om. There's a key element that you're seeming to not notice: using force to do something against the girl's wishes. [Quickly cuz it's not the point, I only grope in a way that a cafe om girl herself initiates.]

That is what I saw in that nightclub. A girl being held from behind tightly by a guy, her struggling to get away, his finger going up and in. It's that style that I'm talking about. Manhandling the girls. Making them do what the guy wants. Being amused by their protests, like that's part of the fun. That is obviously not ok. It sounds like you have never witnessed that kind of thing, so I guess it means you've been lucky or I've been very unlucky. It's not standard, of course. But it's common enough that I've seen it.

Now in a FS situation, it would mean the girl gets held down and sex done more rape style. Or more than one customer at once as they use her like a toy (I have seen girls being given over to 2 guys to go to hotel with), making her do what they want whether she wants to or not. Motorbike girls can't refuse which customers they go with.

We both know the pimp does not hang out outside the hotel waiting for the girl to finish to see if she's ok. Customers like this would easily be gone before she had a chance to do anything, and is the pimp really gonna be motivated to come to her rescue and physically confront a guy for her? I think those girls in particular are plenty vulnerable to bad customers.

[Wendella]

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

man this is pointless ...so you saw girls hadned to two guys...what does that even mean..two guys riding on a bike NORMAL, one girls on the bike with the pimp ..and the pimp goes with the two guys.....so that means what...that doenst mean anything, the one guy is driving his mate to the hotel the pimp is driving the girl to hotel ONE guys goes in and fucks, the frend waits elsewhere, unless u see the girl walk in with two guys into teh hotel room, your ovservation means nothing

Actually you're the one speculating here. That's the outcome you want, so you try to finesse it to be that. No, the 2 guys took the girl all the way into the hotel room and then treated her like a sex toy, did whatever they wanted. One did her from behind while the other skull fucked her. Pimp had no problem with handing her off to them, knowing it was gonna be 2 on 1. They did this regularly. See what I'm saying? It was a couple guys who sometimes hung out with a group I used to hang out with, they talked about it. One Vietnamese, one foreigner. It was their thing. They never failed to get takers for their type of entertainment. Sorry I know that wasn't exactly fair to hold back on that detail, I played coy. Tom, it definitely does happen.

....secondly the pimp DOES have a intereste, if the girls is damaged she CANT work and earn him money!!!...so of course he is within a close distance, ALL guys know this, and if you are going to traumatise or torment her then you should expect to pay..either physically or pay momentary...

Not convinced. I myself have been taken blocks away to a hotel (2nd choice cuz first refused us) and pimp had no idea where we were. But even when close by they're usually round the corner having a drink at a streetside cafe or something. If the girl isn't able to get to her phone, and the guy does things that merely traumatize the girl but don't injure, they can do it and walk away. Pimp doesn't see the girl til after they're gone. And I'm not sure a pimp is gonna be willing to stick up for a girl if she's forced to have sex rape style, forceful manner. He might back her up on refusing that customer next time, but I think that's usually going to be the extent of it.

this is classic wendella see something google translate something and COMPLETELY misread the situation...and WHY cant motogirl refuse customers, i have see moto girls refuse guys just cuz they foreigners....

so are you suggesting that it's standard for motorbike girls to be allowed to refuse customers? Do you think the norm out there is that motorbike girls can refuse to go with drunk guys?

and my story with you and the cafe om is tis...WHEN SOMEONE is looking from the OUTSIDE like you did in the club, someone could easily misread the situiation and say that you were mistreating and tormenting the girl..just as you may have with the guys in the club...grope in the way a girl initiates, she grabs your hand and pushed ur finger in her pussy, she grabs your head and makes u lick her nipples?...somehows i dont think so

well, you should think so. Any time I've had that level of service in a cafe om, I mean literally in one yes the girl TOOK MY HAND and placed it inside her bra, and then did the same, TOOK MY HAND and placed it down inside her panties and on her bush with fingers resting directly on the vagina. She pulled her top open and then pulled my face onto her bare breasts, seemed like a clear invitation to kiss/lick them. Standard? Aboslutely not. Uncommon. For me at least. But it's happened a few times to me. (with another one it was more about french kissing a long time). In your experience, is that rare? I only talk to guys here and ISG about this stuff, so I actually do not know if what I experienced is common or rare. Also from what you're saying, something this indiscreet looks bad/embarrassing in a cafe om, is that right?

But the point was that what I saw was girls being forced to do things against their wishes, and it was obvious. In 4 in 1 club, the trapped girl wriggled free and tried to run off to the ladies' room, a guy caught her by the arm and pulled her back, wrapped his arms round her and picked up a whiskey, put it to her mouth to force her to drink more. I did not misinterpret what was going on. The body language was clear: she was being manhandled, held against her will, forced to drink whiskey. The guy was holding the glass and pouring it into her mouth. Her arms at her sides. You seem to so much want this to not be true. It happened. It was so disturbing. And I'm not even here claiming that this is typical. But I have definitely seen nasty situations like these. Do you think this kind of thing never happens here? Men here never physically overpower and bully girls? There's no rape here?

I mentioned once before going with a motorbike girl who had cigarette burns on her belly, four of them. Definitely cigarette burns. These things do happen here.

[hoian]

Pointless then. U will just say I use Photoshop or whatever.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

yeah show teh whatsapp mesages...even tho thats easy to fake between your accounts...

That's right. They are controlled by local pimps who will not think twice to stab u with a knife if u try anything funny. But you are a pimp in the sense that u bring unsuspecting newbies to dark alleys to fuck cheap whores.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

i def dont control any prostitutes...

I dun make any money out of it and I thought I was doing those gals a favour. And I have stopped after one or two guys who seemed like wasting everybody's time.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

from your descripotion of a pimp by passing on your wechat girls you also a pimp....

That has already been establised as a lie. U used a clone to dig for info from lausung and he has already come forward to make things clear....that I did not "beg" for contacts.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

you begging for contacts is just that act all big but end up begging for contacts whats that go to do with harming anyone...

I did not say u harmed anyone and if u did... thats for your conscience to answer. All I know is you use clever click-baits to lure newbies to further your pimp service. I have nothing against u providing service for lazy ppl but pls do not beat around the bush and just come out and admit it.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

if you think harming someone is the issue who am i harming..

Which eventually he has spoken up. As for u... the only ppl who speak up for you are your blind bat customers who thinks they owe u a favour for showing them cheap whores which are actually a dime a dozen.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

surely if you helped someone they will voluntarily speak up in your defense like this lausung guy...why they dont say anything...why are there guys who speak up for me, even tho im supposedly such a cad like you say...more lies

[hoian]

Actually YOU are the one who is filled with bullshit. Twist and turn the truth and create lies to your convenience.

Use clones to dig for info (and swearing u have no clones).

Anyway, the recent posts have establised that you are big-time LIAR and certainly NOT a person with integrity.

Your only beef with me is that I saw through all your DECEIT. And that makes me your No. 1 target for character assassination.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

see this is another example of your bullshit...

[lausung]

The truth is out, i did ask you for hotel info because i am curious to know which hotel cost only US$20 but same quality as hotel US$50-70. That is the why i am curious which hotel.
https://sammy.services/showpo...postcount=8278

As for the printscreen pm which u ask me to introduce girls, i did not know is a joke until now.
Since all truth have been out, you also clarify is a joke, lets just bury everything and stop fighting

Originally Posted by hoian

That has already been establised as a lie. U used a clone to dig for info from lausung and he has already come forward to make things clear....that I did not "beg" for contacts.

[lausung]

Actually Mr Tom aka Mutantchicken did not lied, let me make a fair statement for him too. Before my first trip to vietnam, i talk to alot of bros including you and some are friends of H88. Despite unhappiness over the war create by him, they admit that Tom aka MC is legendary, one of the best in vietnam sex industry. I proceed to meet him secretly after fail attempt on wechat girls. I did not include that in my FR for fear of unhappiness.

I am happy over the places he brought me, just ask Wendella whom i gave him the 800K FS MP, he went there, came back and verify that the quality of girls are very good. These places are further pass on to densha and more people but it's origin from Tom aka MC.
Sharing is Caring.

Originally Posted by hoian

Actually YOU are the one who is filled with bullshit. Twist and turn the truth and create lies to your convenience.

Use clones to dig for info (and swearing u have no clones).

[lausung]

No problem, i hope all these fight will come to an end.
No one gonna gain anything by winning the fight here.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

thanks, mate, i dont like to expose who i bring around...nor do i pressure anyone to post fr report abt my trips...buts since you voluntarily post i can only acknowledge it and again thank you

[Wendella]

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

see this is another example of your bullshit...first you say that local guys have a gang rape behaviour, which is what i objected based on your club experience, which in your narrative you include in bia om which i know for a fact you dont have much experience in. then to prove you point it expands to local guys being able to mishandle moto girls, being able to rape them etc etc NOW the story shifts to the gang rape of a moto girls BUT the perpetrators is a local guys AND a FOREIGNER...and even if that whats to happen, what is wrong with a MMF scenario...on a the forum tehre are actually local guys who post looking for a 3rd guy to MMF their wifes and girls friends...if a girl is willing to have tow guys for ex tar money thats her choice...even some of teh online girls openly put 300k for 1 shot and if its 2 guys its 400k a shot... 2 guys and girl doenst mean they tormented her or anything...or are u saying they told u they physocally abused they girls beat her up engaged in some pretty nasty stuff, not just some throat fucking or whatever

sorry I'm in the middle of work, can't reply to all the points. I meant that SOME local guys here do have that aggressive mentality. Not all. It's not the norm. I thought I had made that clear in my previous posts. You seem to acknowledge that of course that does exist here so maybe we're not really too far apart on this issue. Yeah the problem is that the girls weren't always willing, didn't have any choice in the matter, and the guys got off on treating her disrespectfully. Not beat her up, no. But that other girl with cigarette burns, yeah, that's just evil shit. Just saying, this stuff happens. And girls working in those busier low-rung scenes are going to encounter these kinds of things and have no way to prevent it or avoid it.

[hoian]

Here we go. Another mystery solved.
First Tom-wadever denied ever contacting lausung.
Then lausung willingly admit being his customer.

----

lausung: I have no beef with u. U can find any pimp u like, none of my biz. But I just dun like all these lies he is creating about me.

Tom-wadever confirmed LIAR.
Confirmed making up stories about me.
Case closed I guess.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

...no proof i even have contact with lausung...

Originally Posted by lausung

I proceed to meet him secretly after fail attempt on wechat girls...I am happy over the places he brought me...

[lausung]

He denied because i did not want to let people know i met him.
It is partly my fault. However i stand out and write because you have put alot of wrong accusation.

Me too have no beef with you but Tom aka MC motive is clear, so i contact him myself.
But for you, you pm me to meet up when i am in Vietnam.
Your motive are unclear.

I have not login to this forum for a long time. I could not understand why for a person with business or job like you have so much free time to come here and shoot someone everyday unless you are using this forum to benefit yourself. This is all but a cyberworld.

Get a life outside this forum please.
Bye bye

Originally Posted by hoian

Here we go. Another mystery solved.
First Tom-wadever denied ever contacting lausung.
Then lausung willingly admit being his customer.

----

lausung: I have no beef with u. U can find any pimp u like, none of my biz. But I just dun like all these lies he is creating about me.

Tom-wadever confirmed LIAR.
Confirmed making up stories about me.
Case closed I guess.

[hoian]

He said this... I said that. Lausung finally admits to being your customer. U and him are in cahoots. Anyway case closed.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

...you said...i have used...

[lausung]

Nono Mr hoian dun mistaken. I am a tourist not in cahoots with him. After i left vietnam, no plans to return. I gave all the secret location to wendella, u can check with him if you dun believe. If i am in cahoots, i will never reveal those.
Please be reasonable, I always see you as a successful man, do not let anger cloud your mind.

I am just trying to illustrate, today i accuse u this, next day u accuse him that, no end to the argument. No one is going to gain anything.
Anyway have a nice day ahead.

Regards.
Lausung

Originally Posted by hoian

He said this... I said that. Lausung finally admits to being your customer. U and him are in cahoots. Anyway case closed.

[hoian]

So now you are flatly denying that you, Tom-wadever, is a clone of mutantchicken who was banned from this forum?

Your other clones could be hoian-pukgai or hoian-father... i have no idea how many others there are. I am quite flattered that clone accts were actually created for the sole purpose of attacking me.

Originally Posted by TomMAffolter

...then you accused me of using clones to ...

I have no anger. I come to this forum just for fun. I have no intention to meet anyone in person (following sammyboy-boss' advice). Although, I did break that rule once and met someone for supper just to kill time but that was definitely my first and last time.

Originally Posted by lausung

...do not let anger cloud your mind...