Liverpool Fc @ Anfield - Reds Supporters Gatherings

[KingEros]

Guys, let's try to differ from the supporters of other EPL clubs a bit ...
As part of the YNWA brigade, we need to keep up our image of "knowledgeable fans on the Kop".

Originally Posted by jootjoot

Maclaren's eyes soiled with shit cos he doens't know how to treasure a player lilke JC..

First thing first, as much as I dun like it, there are good reasons why Carra is not first choice (or even second choice) in the England backline ...
1) he's the #1 versatile defender in England ... nobody else can play centre-back & full-back (either left or right) equally well - for this, he's always been preferred to be used as the super-sub for the entire defence, first during Eriksson's era & now in McClaren's reign.
2) he defends very well but he has zero ability where scoring goal is concerned ... unlike Terry, who puts in more than a handful each season from set-pieces - this is ultra important where international football is concerned, coz goals are even harder to come by.
3) he is not a natural, where bringing the ball out of his own half is concerned ... for that, there is Ferdinand & King, in that order - in LFC colours, it was also Hyypia (previously) & Agger (now) who's doing this job on a more regular basis.

Originally Posted by hawksbay

well rafa was attached to milan when baresi was playing, guess thats why jc has improved over the last couple of season.

Originally Posted by beck7777

Wooo... Baresi was the best defender on his day!
But then, who dare say they are better than JC when he's on form?!

Gents ... from what I put forth above, it's really quite lame to draw parallel between Carra & Baresi, 'coz they are totally different types doing different jobs on the field.
If you really hafta, the closest LFC defender that can hold a candle to Baresi would be Hansen ... of course, many of you might find his era too distant to remember.
If you really hafta too, the closest Italian defender that may pass off as a role model for Carra would be Bergomi ... just like Carra, his was a no-nonsense style of defending where determination overcame a lack of natural ability.

Lastly, it'd be good to know Rafa (like all other managers in an EPL set-up) do not train the team other than tactics & set-pieces ... under him, he has an entire coaching staff, each specifically responsible for fitness, goalkeeping, defending & attacking ... or even sports psychology.
In other words, the most influential person who contributed to what Carra is today is definitely not Rafa ... the man is none other than Hyypia, & to a lesser extent, Henchoz. Dun tell me none of you can remember how the man is so good at throwing himself at blocking any goalbound shots??
Moreover, Rafa is only into his 4th season ... you mean you guys feel or realise Carra is a great defender only within the last 2-3 seasons??

[beck7777]

Of cos we know JC is not the complete overall super defender...
But we do know he is good, and extremely important to Liverpool defence..

We always says how Gerrard saves the day but we hardly remember how JC keeps opponents out...

I used to say, we score dont mean we will win, but we keep clean sheets, we confirm wont lose... (crappy)

[KingEros]

Originally Posted by beck7777

I used to say, we score dont mean we will win, but we keep clean sheets, we confirm wont lose... (crappy)

Yah, I'd say it's crappy too ...
'Coz this is what Rafa has realised in his time in England ... LFC dun lose that many matches, that's why they are always still in the Top 4 ... it's the games which they cannot win that has resulted in them not being within the Top 2 after each frustrating season.

[Castrol]

Originally Posted by KingEros

Carra declined becoz he didn't agree that this was a crisis situation & he wasn't convinced that McClaren would keep him once the wounded (Terry & King) recovered.
That's when McClaren activated Campbell, who crawled back like a faithful dog.

its no good lah, no player should "retire" from national duty simply becos he is not 1st 11. the national players are playing for the country, not for the manager mcclaren or eriksson etc.

[beck7777]

Originally Posted by Castrol

its no good lah, no player should "retire" from national duty simply becos he is not 1st 11. the national players are playing for the country, not for the manager mcclaren or eriksson etc.

Bro, its the managers who choose where he plays though...

Imagine JC is our top defender but he was treated like shit in the national team, making him plugged holes when required...

Till now, its a mystery to me why he is not a 1st choice for England...

[boon huat]

Originally Posted by KingEros

Yah, I'd say it's crappy too ...
'Coz this is what Rafa has realised in his time in England ... LFC dun lose that many matches, that's why they are always still in the Top 4 ... it's the games which they cannot win that has resulted in them not being within the Top 2 after each frustrating season.

our 2 problems....killing off the mid-table teams who played negative tactics against us = draws, taking off points from the other big 3...

this season will be very exciting cos teams such as newcastle, spurs, and a few others have spent and will improve significantly, so these teams will provide a tougher fight to the big 4. If our players can settle and click faster then we can edge ahead...but i wont be too disappointed with a top 3 finish and good cup runs as this season's a bedding in period for our players...

[KingEros]

Originally Posted by Castrol

its no good lah, no player should "retire" from national duty simply becos he is not 1st 11. the national players are playing for the country, not for the manager mcclaren or eriksson etc.

Uncle, Carra has been serving his country since age-group level ... he was even captain for the Under-19 & Under-21.
His plight is such that he's just a few years short of 30 already ... so, he's no longer prepared to stay by the sideline waiting for the rare chance.
In the long run, he's actually doing his country a favour ...
1) his country is currently ably served by Terry & Ferdinand (plus King & Dawson) ... at least that's what can be deciphered from McClaren's personal pecking orders.
2) the future of his country is better served ... by his stepping aside, so that the next generation of centre-halves in their early-20s can start accummulating experience on the international scene.
Think about it ...

[rahl]

Originally Posted by KingEros

2) he defends very well but he has zero ability where scoring goal is concerned ... unlike Terry, who puts in more than a handful each season from set-pieces - this is ultra important where international football is concerned, coz goals are even harder to come by.

Moreover, Rafa is only into his 4th season ... you mean you guys feel or realise Carra is a great defender only within the last 2-3 seasons??

Bro, it's fine to think of defence partnerships (one tackler and one game-reader) and goalscoring defenders but McClaren shows what a moron he is in the world of football management when he ushered into Jamie's rightback slot, the great (bumbler) Wes Brown.

I think what's great about Jamie (and I don't think he is unheralded anymore as a Pool player) is his progress as a defender. I remember he started out in CB under Evans. And the commentator was saying in the first league game of the season, quite rightly, he and his partner (Babb? Matteo?) couldn't defend against high balls for nuts.

Then he moved to RB and LB and got a lot of stick for his inability to cross or beat defenders. But I remember just before he went back to CB, he was improving in his forays down the flanks (although annoyingly he would often brake and then pass backwards). 100% player.

[KingEros]

Originally Posted by boon huat

killing off the mid-table teams who played negative tactics

This is the same for all of the other Big 4 or 5 ...
Also the very reason why we trailed Manure or Chelskis by a lot of points at the end of last season & 3 seasons ago, respectively.
To win the EPL, we need to be able to break down opposition defences ... & score the critical goal.

Originally Posted by boon huat

taking off points from the other big 3...

IMHO, this part depends a lot on luck ... 'coz there's really not much difference between the Top 4 when they play each other, so it's really the performance on the day that counts.
This time round, luck is with us that Chelsea cannot play their first choice backline next week, plus the fact that the match is at home for us ... it's really up to us to lose the match.
I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

Originally Posted by boonhuat

this season will be very exciting cos teams such as newcastle, spurs, and a few others have spent and will improve significantly...
If our players can settle and click faster then we can edge ahead...

Well, you can take a good look at Spurs ... after 2 matches, they are right at the bottom of the table with 2 convincing losses.
Ability to secure good players with had cash is one thing, gelling the team into a synergised fighting unit is another totally.
On this count, LFC is having it good this season ... I mean, other than Aurelio, there are no significant injuries, meaning Rafa has really no restraints on deciding his Best 11 in the matches so far ... & the coming ones.

Originally Posted by boonhuat

but i wont be too disappointed with a top 3 finish and good cup runs as this season's a bedding in period for our players...

Uncle, with the amount of money involved ... there's no such thing in the EPL as "bedding-in period" liao.
Think about it, by the time the team is bedded in, so would others ... not to mention that more big-ticket purchases will only be the norm for half of the EPL teams in years to come.
Very bluntly put, I dun even know if Rafa is still gonna be around if LFC dun at least get into Top 2 this season:
1) the Americans were not the one who "chose" Rafa as the messiah
2) the Americans have already "given" him his chance
Although I really dunno who can & is available to fill Rafa's shoes ...

[beck7777]

Originally Posted by KingEros

[Uncle, with the amount of money involved ... there's no such thing in the EPL as "bedding-in period" liao.
Think about it, by the time the team is bedded in, so would others ... not to mention that more big-ticket purchases will only be the norm for half of the EPL teams in years to come.
Very bluntly put, I dun even know if Rafa is still gonna be around if LFC dun at least get into Top 2 this season:
1) the Americans were not the one who "chose" Rafa as the messiah
2) the Americans have already "given" him his chance
Although I really dunno who can & is available to fill Rafa's shoes ...

Agreed... The "chance" was given to Rafa when the money was there to spend...

The Yankees are businessmen.. They expect returns after so much cash spent.. So I'm sure they expect Rafa to deliver as well..

But come to think about it, who will replace Rafa then? WengeR?

[KingEros]

Originally Posted by rahl

McClaren shows what a moron he is in the world of football management when he ushered into Jamie's rightback slot, the great (bumbler) Wes Brown.

Erm ... I read that as Wes Brown accepting his role as a seat-warmer for a certain Mr Neville - which is also fully reflective of the moron in McClaren. But then again, does it surprise you & me that McClaren is counting on his personal ties with Manure players, which goes unquestioned becoz there are EPL champions after all.
Furthermore, it's been eons since Carra has played as a LFC full-back ... so I think Carra (or even McClaren himself) wanna play there just for a starting place in the England line-up.

Originally Posted by rahl

I think what's great about Jamie (and I don't think he is unheralded anymore as a Pool player) is his progress as a defender... 100% player.

Yup, he has my total respect as someone who continue to work hard & even harder until he reaches the pinnacle ... not unlike Mr Keegan, who's really all effort & determination in his playing days - a total contrast to Mr Dalglish, who's so natural in dishing out the superhuman passes & goals.

[beck7777]

In short, its the club that benefit from his retirement...

He can solely focus on Liverpool, no more extra travelling for country..

Longer summer break too during WC/EC... (That is England qualifed in the 1st place under MacShit)

[Castrol]

Originally Posted by beck7777

Imagine JC is our top defender but he was treated like shit in the national team, making him plugged holes when required...

Till now, its a mystery to me why he is not a 1st choice for England...

this is what i meant, carragher can criticize the manager if the manager treats him like dirt, but he shouldnt stop playing for the country.

Originally Posted by KingEros

2) the future of his country is better served ... by his stepping aside, so that the next generation of centre-halves in their early-20s can start accummulating experience on the international scene.
Think about it ...

hahaha... carragher is still too young to "step aside". what if john terry and rio ferdinand also say want to step aside, how?

maybe they'll say "call me only when the euro or world cup tournaments start".

[KingEros]

Originally Posted by Castrol

hahaha... carragher is still too young to "step aside". what if john terry and rio ferdinand also say want to step aside, how?

Carra is gonna be 30-years-old next Jan ... ie, in another 5 months' time.
That's "still too young" to step aside?? Dun forget, this is stepping aside as the 3rd or 4th choice ... not as the 1st or 2nd choice.

In comparison, if Terry or Ferdinand wanna step aside (while only in their mid 20s & as automatic choices), then they are just playing hard to get.

[beck7777]

Ya loh.. JC hitting 30 soon...

When you are established, and still treated like shit by your country, I also will stepped aside...
Dont be like Campbell, MacMoron asked, then he readily say yes...
Is that showing he love his country? I not too sure... Maybe it is...

Other than EPL, what else JC have not won yet? So why be treated that way in the international stage?

Good decision JC!