14-year-old jumps to his death after unaccompanied police interrogation for Molest

[Copperfield]

By: Ghui

Being a teenager is a tricky period even in the best of times. Facing adolescence in the glare of social media coupled with modern day school pressures must make it an even more confusing time. My heart really goes out to the family of teenager Benjamin Lee (http://theindependent.sg/i-wanna-be-...interrogation/) whose suicide after a police interrogation has now made headlines in Singapore.

A few issues of concern have been raised since this episode and for this death not to have been in vain, lessons have to be learnt in how we handle interrogations of minors.

From the few police statements that have been made, it would appear that the police have already presumed Lee’s guilt. Whatever has happened to “innocent until proven guilty”? While Singapore prides itself on its efficiency, has that seeped into our law enforcement system to our detriment? Is everything so results oriented that having a cased solved becomes more of an overriding concern than the welfare of a minor?

More disturbing is the revelation that guardians or parents are not permitted to be present with minors when they are being interrogated. (http://theindependent.sg/death-of-14...ays-filmmaker/)

Apparently the police are concerned that if parents or guardians are present, they would not get the truth. For this to be true, the minor in question would have to be a very confident and savvy kid who is well acquainted with the legal system which I suspect is very rare.

Why then is a practice developed to safeguard something that is reasonably rare at the expense of the welfare of a minor? Could this be a hangover from the 60s and 70s when kids grew up fast and gangsterism was rife? Are these concerns still relevant today?

I would imagine that having the reassuring presence of a parent or guardian present would give the minor in question the confidence to tell the truth!

Something out of point, I don't know about the confidence part. Lets say the police ask me if I got masturbate, I don't think i got more confidence when my parents are around to tell the truth. Never met anyone with such balls yet.

[kuasimi]

Originally Posted by Copperfield

He said you to the mum rite? why assume he talking about the Police? Past reference means nothing to this case. If someone was convicted of theft in the past, no need to investigate meh? blame him can already?

My teacher last time accused me of stealing. I did not. He no believe me. He was wrong, does that mean he is wrong all the time? The police can be wrong in the past but that has nothing to do with this case. Will i kpkb about my teacher? i would, does that mean all teachers are evil? no reference lei. Ai yah, You read the article without an open mind.

I dont understand your entire passage above. It is totally irrelevant to the case.

First you accuse the dead boy was guilty of molest and said nothing wrong with SPF but cannot produce evidence dead boy was guilty.

I asked you to read what dead boy family had to say before commenting. You start twisting until give some irrelevant analogy.

The story is simple. Dead boy confessed to molest after 3 hours interrogation by SPF. Dead boy family dispute entire interrogation process and confession and claim dead boy told mum he did not do it. His confession was false. In this case, the question to ask was how SPF get the confession.

If the mum was the one that say he was guilty of molest, why did dead boy family come out to dispute SPF's confession?

Why would the mum even accuse the dead boy of molest when the mum later tell him not to rashly confess if he did not do it?

You failed comprehension or something?

It is SPF's words versus the dead boy family's words. It will never be resolved.

Even you want to defend PAP and SPF, please talk sense.

[FuLuSh0u]

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Someone jumps, everyone blames the police. But the last hour or so, the boy was actually with his mother rite? Anyone knows whay happened then? Police catch molester wrong? If my daughter is molested and she pointed out that boy, if bloody hell police don't bring back, I think I sure smack his face.

Just one case, changes will happened. Police will have tough time in future

[kuasimi]

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Something out of point, I don't know about the confidence part. Lets say the police ask me if I got masturbate, I don't think i got more confidence when my parents are around to tell the truth. Never met anyone with such balls yet.

Like you said, it is out of point and irrelevant to actual topic.

[Copperfield]

Originally Posted by kuasimi

I dont understand your entire passage above. It is totally irrelevant to the case.

First you accuse the dead boy was guilty of molest and said nothing wrong with SPF but cannot produce evidence dead boy was guilty.

I asked you to read what dead boy family had to say before commenting. You start twisting until give some irrelevant analogy.

The story is simple. Dead boy confessed to molest after 3 hours interrogation by SPF. Dead boy family dispute entire interrogation process and confession and claim dead boy told mum he did not do it. His confession was false. In this case, the question to ask was how SPF get the confession.

If the mum was the one that say he was guilty of molest, why did dead boy family come out to dispute SPF's confession?

Why would the mum even accuse the dead boy of molest when the mum later tell him not to rashly confess if he did not do it?

You failed comprehension or something?

It is SPF's words versus the dead boy family's words. It will never be resolved.

Even you want to defend PAP and SPF, please talk sense.

First you accuse the dead boy was guilty of molest and said nothing wrong with SPF but cannot produce evidence dead boy was guilty. - I never say he was guilty. But he is the suspect rite? Police can speak to suspect rite?

I asked you to read what dead boy family had to say before commenting. You start twisting until give some irrelevant analogy. - I did read. Still never see the part that the Police had force the boy to admit. The mother only say why you admit if you never do, which meant that he did admit to the deed. Did the son say he was abuse into admitting? he was with the mother for over an hour but never mentioned that?

The story is simple. Dead boy confessed to molest after 3 hours interrogation by SPF. Dead boy family dispute entire interrogation process and confession and claim dead boy told mum he did not do it. His confession was false. In this case, the question to ask was how SPF get the confession.

If the mum was the one that say he was guilty of molest, why did dead boy family come out to dispute SPF's confession?


-- I also never see the part where they dispute the confession. I only see the part that they dispute why the Police never wait for NOK or no legal guardian was with the boy during the statement, which the police's released statement is saying that they will reviewed. I don't see anything in that statement that mentioned that they did anything wrong.

please read :“My son died a very unjustified death,” exclaimed Mr Lim. “Why couldn’t they have waited until school was over? Why couldn’t they have waited till his parents were around?”

Spare a thought for the victim. I dont know if she is really molested or not. But what if she is?

I'm not defending anyone. People can see facts. I'm just stating what i read but you are aggressively trying to twist your points. Good luck to you. You live in such a negative world. I wish you best of luck.

[Summerhillt]

Apparently, let me tell you how fucked up this situation is. Firstly what are we about to talk about? Pinpoint who? What? Why?

Firstly let me share some of my personal real life experience. I grew up in a normal family. Not rich no car, father drives a taxi. Everything was really hard. My studies were good. Above average. But I chose to mix with the pai kias in my secondary school. Joined their di Tao since I was sec 2 cause I was a real fighter. I could take down a sec 3 guy. You know, when you wear short pants in school, you win a fight against a long pants guy you are really upzz. My grades did not slip, still can get edusave bursary year after year. But things fucked up, when we eventually got into a gang fight and deadly weapons were used.

Ccb, last time ssb really fucking efficient. Our gang photo with everybody at our own zai dui and " pak logo " from friendster was saved and printed out big big like drawing block A3 Size and each individual face circled out.

When I was schooling, every classroom got this white box intercom box. Everytime light up, its either whole school together announce or office to classroom. Ccb I was told go report to general office. I see policeman lah, ssb lah, all the fuckers act in front of the school staff. Cheebye when I go in the van, the fucking pai kia bengs jitao kan me ancestors 18 generation.

Can you imagine? I so young only at that point of time but kena fuck hokkien language by so many " ah beng " police officer. Gold hair all. Pui cao nua at them. On the way back go cantoment keep fucking me non stop say I going jialat and they convinently ask me my neighbouring vicinity ah long spraypaint is it all I do one as well? I fuck that staff Sgt cheebye. Step fierce. Anything also want to link to me.

Kena lock up, can see other members inside already as well. I was not kept separately, but instead lock up with people who are of adult age looks more scary than your average uncle. Still rmbr got one is drug addict locked up together. He sniff glue for the 10x time with his gf. His gf locked beside us.

So can you imagine? A 14 year old who prolly got no "other side" experience of life ? Not street smart? Just suddenly got hauled up by pai kia lookalike officers who haul expletives at you and say you 死路一条 how would u feel? But what a fucking joke. Ask a 13 year old to sign the statement. Like this might as well ask 13 years old to sign credit card and wait parents to pay.

Cut short my story, io when recording statement keep fucking me. Say you admit lah cheebye, your other member all say you got whack liao. You admit we charge lesser.

But I know, my members will not shoot. We say before, we will not paotoh no matter what. Last time CCTV not as rampant as before. But still, we kena fuck again by the ssb. They say they will register our nric as member of secrect society duno what fuck. Say we at cantoment 17th floor can be regular.

Cause not enough evidence, released. Lucky one member the parents open provision shop. Very rich, hire lawyer fight the case and go until meet the MP. When MP letter come all become scaredy cats pui cao nua.

End of the day. Warning letter for me cause I too young. Was I afraid? Yes I was. But because I grew up in a rugged environment hence I could handle it.

If a normal young kid had to go through what I had gone through. Surely he would confessed and be scared. Police won't help you. They just want to charge you and close case and improve kpi.

Can't believe till now, they still using this tactic.

But luckily for me, I was mentally strong and lol decided to stay away from all these and got on the better side of life. But yea, fuck the police.

[sadfa]

Originally Posted by Summerhillt

Apparently, let me tell you how fucked up this situation is. Firstly what are we about to talk about? Pinpoint who? What? Why?

Firstly let me share some of my personal real life experience. I grew up in a normal family. Not rich no car, father drives a taxi. Everything was really hard. My studies were good. Above average. But I chose to mix with the pai kias in my secondary school. Joined their di Tao since I was sec 2 cause I was a real fighter. I could take down a sec 3 guy. You know, when you wear short pants in school, you win a fight against a long pants guy you are really upzz. My grades did not slip, still can get edusave bursary year after year.

If a normal young kid had to go through what I had gone through. Surely he would confessed and be scared. Police won't help you. They just want to charge you and close case and improve kpi.

Can't believe till now, they still using this tactic.

But luckily for me, I was mentally strong and lol decided to stay away from all these and got on the better side of life. But yea, fuck the police.

Respect to you even though you're a si ginna for telling the truth about these cb police. Home team my lj.
Only these stupid sporeans think a bunch of cowards hiding behind guns damn eh sai.

All these are failed gangsters.
And if they meet a si ginna one on one in thailand n they got no gun, its time they get fucked n beaten up like a bitch.

[kuasimi]

https://www.facebook.com/TheIndependentSG



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[Summerhillt]

Originally Posted by sadfa

Respect to you even though you're a si ginna for telling the truth about these cb police. Home team my lj.
Only these stupid sporeans think a bunch of cowards hiding behind guns damn eh sai.

All these are failed gangsters.
And if they meet a si ginna one on one in thailand n they got no gun, its time they get fucked n beaten up like a bitch.

No more si ginnah lah, now just an old uncle Liao.. Thinking how to earn more money lah..

[kuasimi]

Originally Posted by Copperfield

First you accuse the dead boy was guilty of molest and said nothing wrong with SPF but cannot produce evidence dead boy was guilty. - I never say he was guilty. But he is the suspect rite? Police can speak to suspect rite?

I asked you to read what dead boy family had to say before commenting. You start twisting until give some irrelevant analogy. - I did read. Still never see the part that the Police had force the boy to admit. The mother only say why you admit if you never do, which meant that he did admit to the deed. Did the son say he was abuse into admitting? he was with the mother for over an hour but never mentioned that?

The story is simple. Dead boy confessed to molest after 3 hours interrogation by SPF. Dead boy family dispute entire interrogation process and confession and claim dead boy told mum he did not do it. His confession was false. In this case, the question to ask was how SPF get the confession.

If the mum was the one that say he was guilty of molest, why did dead boy family come out to dispute SPF's confession?


-- I also never see the part where they dispute the confession. I only see the part that they dispute why the Police never wait for NOK or no legal guardian was with the boy during the statement, which the police's released statement is saying that they will reviewed. I don't see anything in that statement that mentioned that they did anything wrong.

please read :“My son died a very unjustified death,” exclaimed Mr Lim. “Why couldn’t they have waited until school was over? Why couldn’t they have waited till his parents were around?”

Spare a thought for the victim. I dont know if she is really molested or not. But what if she is?

I'm not defending anyone. People can see facts. I'm just stating what i read but you are aggressively trying to twist your points. Good luck to you. You live in such a negative world. I wish you best of luck.

You are going round and round just to defend the indefensible. You are twisting facts.

Nobody is saying the dead boy is not a suspect and SPF cannot interrogate the dead boy but there are many suspects but only one real culprit.

Suspect only but no charge is a very normal scenario. You sound dead sure the dead boy did it. You know the meaning of suspect only?

Again, it goes back to the point HOW the SPF interrogate the dead boy and get the confession which is the entire point of this thread.

You kept diverting and twisting your own meaning.

It is obvious the dead boy family dispute the entire process from school to interrogation.

If the dead boy family dont dispute the confession, why even mention son died with eyes open, why dispute police taking and interrogating son without parents presence, why say the son admit he did not do it, say the son confessed out of fustration rather than guilt? Why even find TOC to write such a long article different from MSM?

Everybody is innocent until judge say you are guilty. Why ask the hypothetical question if girl was really molested? It means not sure right?

Even if girl was really molested, the process flaws from school until interrogation remains else why SPF say conduct review?

Now you want to accuse people who dispute the authorities as negative people to win your argument? Irrelevant.

Please go and stay at North Korea, ISIS and China. The citizens there do not dispute with authorities, these countries are very positive and the authorities are always right.

[Summerhillt]

What we hope to see some light shed upon would be what is the standard procedure when apprehending a suspect who is not of a legal age and were they thoroughly followed. Were any unorthodox methods used? Simple as that. Did the boy molest or not is another question.. I just hope that the deceased family can hold on tight together.. It's the lunar new year soon and such a devastating thing chanced upon that family..

Can the IO sleep or not at night? I say he would prolly sleep tight and really sound if he followed SOP and there was no inditimdation on his part.

But if the IO used some sly pui cao nua tactics on that poor child. I wish him a very advanced happy cny.

[sadfa]

Originally Posted by Summerhillt

What we hope to see some light shed upon would be what is the standard procedure when apprehending a suspect who is not of a legal age and were they thoroughly followed. Were any unorthodox methods used? Simple as that. Did the boy molest or not is another question.. I just hope that the deceased family can hold on tight together.. It's the lunar new year soon and such a devastating thing chanced upon that family..

Can the IO sleep or not at night? I say he would prolly sleep tight and really sound if he followed SOP and there was no inditimdation on his part.

But if the IO used some sly pui cao nua tactics on that poor child. I wish him a very advanced happy cny.

Please la. You should know.

When your job is to get children to sign documents, when these children never even create their own signatures before, n these children don't know the consequences of signing n then you use the document in court, for the court to sentence the children n ruin their lives, you got any conscience meh??

Io cannot sleep only if he never follow procedure n never seek higher approval cos that means disciplinary action n garbagement will sack him n let him take the fall.

Other than that, if he scream at Benjamin, curse n suan his family for being poor, threaten Benjamin n his family, he will still collect salary, celebrate cny, gamble, fuck chicken, Limp kopi, take leave, go holiday, collect bonus, get promotion.

If these people got guilty conscience, they would've quitted long ago le.

When coroner inquiry n review come, everybody will cover each other n fuck care Benjamin. If ppl sabo the io, he will expose all those dirty advanced interrogation tactics they use.

When sporeans hear, even those hard hearted ah peks will cry. The minister won't die but a few supt sure will kanna.

BTW Benjamin cremated liao.
Bet they never even turn up at wake n pay respects. Fuck these fake hypocrites.

[sadfa]

Originally Posted by FuLuSh0u

Just one case, changes will happened. Police will have tough time in future

No change la. Last time, white horse saga, goh said move on. Case finish.

Now, they wont change procedure becos they want the process to be uniform for everyone. Adults, children, foreigner, mentally challenged.

They'll just have a bs step where the court will decide whether the child telling the truth.

[kt88_2]

The garment n SPF really 'look' after n love the true citizens of Singapore.

[remyken]

Knnbccb. Fuck the Singapore police. Only know how to catch children,

For those whom have been interrogated before by them. They will know what kind of pressure that young boy faced.

Even if he did molest, do he deserve to die? Can those fucker police that indirectly killed him, sleep at night?

Fucking wrong system in Singapore.